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Benjamin Jack
Jun 28, 2024
I have really appreciated the discussion of penta melody, http://www.guitargym.co/space/talk?id=CRIENMYU2FX&t=VYHOSKXYBIA so I was wondering what you guys think about the other games.

My personal favorite is fretmaster, as it is the foundation of all the others, and is a great tool for learning to sight read guitar. However, I think that if in the later levels (140+) The time limit and amount of questions should be increased, as that would force for greater accuracy and is less reliant on high-speed mouse clicking, especially as there are currently not keyboard shortcuts.

My next favorite is Chord Maze, as it lets me never need a chord chart again, and up to about level 135 I was able to use music theory and manipulate CAGED chords to find out 7, dim7, Maj7, minor, add9, etc..
However, around level 145 it gets hectic. All kinds of 6 and 6min, min-maj7, 1/2dim7, and unusual 7 shapes are all introduced at one level that is 100 times harder than any level before it. I had to get out pen and paper to write down chord shapes, and it took me almost 100 games just to pass it, and 146 is similarly hard, with more random 7 shapes and some 145 review.

Next is chord puzzle, basically a companion of chord maze, with similar benefits. It is unfortunately frozen at question 2 of level 120 so I have not been able to experience the crazy level 145 of chord maze chords.

Intervalix is a great interval game and now I can finally differentiate sixths...

I have a new opinion post discussion on penta melody and am finally playing it and I actually kind of like it.

Scale adventure is sort of useful once you get to level 130 and can apply all the pervious levels to maj/min/modal scales, not just 1000s of pentatonic inversions...
Unfortunately, right after introducing dorian, it now gives no questions at level 143.

I wish chorductor had spent more time on solidifying the CAGED chords chord degrees as if you can do this, it allows you to make every other chord you will ever play just from the CAGED chord inversions, IMHO all most other chord types are derived from these by editing the chord degrees, and therefore knowing a min-maj7 chord's 3 is the same as a maj chord's 3 etc.

This is just my opinion, I would love to hear what you guys think, especially @Petr Hartmann @Cuantas Cuerdas @Catherine McKay @Jonny Levin @Bartosz Samitowski @Jose Ledezma @Nicolae Orengo
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Petr Hartmann
Jun 29, 2024
Nice post, @Benjamin Jack!

My favorite is also Fretmaster as learning notes on the neck was always my weakest point - tedious and boring so I always postponed it, worked around it. Closely followed by Intervalix, Chord Maze and Chord Puzzle.

Regarding proposed changes I am nowhere near your levels - in most games I am around 60 - so I don't have the experience. But you described something that happened to me few times on Tone Gym - at some point a very steep difficulty spike occurs and the game goes from easy-peasy to a brick wall. Tbh I don't think I ever played 1/2dim7 on a guitar haha. Fretmaster proposal seems like a good idea.
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Nicolae Orengo
Jun 29, 2024
I agree entirely with the both of you. But it's hard for me to determine a favourite as I think I'm partial to a balanced approach. You both have heard me a few times now drone on about starting to see connections, how some games can inform others as you develop. And it's easy to see Fret master being right in the centre of that Venn Diagram. I think it's a really important one especially for those of us more familiar with a keyboard. I love the idea of being able to see through the fret/string matrix as easily as looking a piano.

One of the games that I've found the most challenging is Chorducter, especially before it was changed to be a bit easier. I'm really digging the progression of it now, it is helping me to see the building blocks of the chords.

But sometimes I feel like so much of my learning process is here is dependent on everything coming together, seeing more of these relationships, having a light-bulb moment in this game that makes all the others easier. It's like my mind doesn't even care to distinguish between the games until we're talking about them!
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Cuantas Cuerdas
Jun 30, 2024
Great dissection, @Benjamin Jack . As a B (maybe C; or D)-league member/player, I can't really add any significant words to what you guys said. I still get much frustration when I grab my guitar and try to do about anything with it, so I don't know where are all these workouts going, at least for now.
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Benjamin Jack (author)
Jul 01, 2024
@Cuantas Cuerdas I recommend starting with just picking up the guitar every day for 5-15 minutes outside of the hands on session, and just playing any chords you can in a semi-musical pattern, or playing a song by ear on one string. You can use this as a way to commit to play the guitar, not just playing games about the guitar.
When I started I struggled to just play anything on the guitar to start, and this helped me have some form of practice, and to develop a habit or playing the guitar.
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Cuantas Cuerdas
Jul 01, 2024
πŸ˜ΆπŸ™πŸ˜Ά
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Petr Hartmann
Jul 01, 2024
@Cuantas Cuerdas what drove me forward in the past was always choosing a slightly more difficult song than I can play at the moment. I usually just grinded and learned every technique necessary to play it thus gaining solid GPI in the process πŸ˜…. It is kind of obvious advice... but for me personally it is much more interesting, satisfying and motivating than exercises, scales etc.
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Benjamin Jack (author)
Jul 01, 2024
I agree with the ability to mark a question as to review. In tone/soundGym you can hit the C key to pause to review the question after you give your answer, I would love to have this ability on GuitarGym @GuitarGym Community
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Benjamin Jack (author)
Jul 02, 2024
As of today, Scale adventure and chord puzzle are unfrozen!!! (I needed to clear the cookies and chache from when they were broken)
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Petr Hartmann
Jul 05, 2024
@Benjamin Jack so I found out I am actually 148 in Fretmaster πŸ˜…. Now there is unlimited fretboard, every level the amount of required answers increases, while the time limit stays the same. That is what you are pointing at, right? I have to admit at some point the mouse really becomes the limiting factor...
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Benjamin Jack (author)
Jul 05, 2024
Yea, I am at level 149 and cannot pass it for the life of me, I get all the questions right as fast as I can click. It has 26 questions and the same old 60sec
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Igor Ishchenko
Jul 05, 2024
@Benjamin Jack try to use a phone, I find it is much faster to tap on it vs moving and clicking with the mouse
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Petr Hartmann
Jul 07, 2024
@Benjamin Jack any luck? Now I get your frustration. Ending fairly consistently around 23/25 - okayish speed, without mistakes. The margin of error is very small. I will manage it in a couple of days, only to be stuck again πŸ˜…
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Benjamin Jack (author)
Jul 07, 2024
No. Best is 25/26 no errors. I tend to do better if the letters are closer to each other even if they have a large musical interval as that leads to better mouse speed with accuracy.
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Petr Hartmann
Jul 16, 2024
@Benjamin Jack finally joined you at level 149 Fret Master. It was way harder than it seemed at first. How are you doing? Also it surprises me that I am 'only' around 95% percentile - almost my lowest of all the games here. There must be some incredibly fast gym heads around here πŸ˜…
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Benjamin Jack (author)
Jul 16, 2024
@Petr Hartmann Still there, I have reached a similar point in Chord Puzzle (level 151 99.82%) were I have to answer 21 questions each with about three notes to fill in per question. this proves to me that my mouse can move that fast and my brain is slower on notes (I still want keyboard shortcuts, however). I am noticing a trend toward more questions rather than harder questions in a few other games. I think the reason they do this is that the first 150ish levels teach and all levels after that force speed and mastery and also do not allow easy GPI. Scale adventure does not seem to do this as soon, I am at level 172 and am still getting only about eight questions, I just need to learn all the modes.
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Petr Hartmann
Jul 16, 2024
@Benjamin Jack mouse is frustrating indeed. But I am only tiny bit faster on touchscreen so for me it is not worth the discomfort. By shortcuts you mean like midi keyboard or just pc keyboard?
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Benjamin Jack (author)
Jul 16, 2024
PC keyboard was what I meant, though midi would be even better as it would bring even closer knowledge of the connections of piano and guitar.
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Petr Hartmann
Jul 18, 2024
@Benjamin Jack 149 cleared πŸ™Œ. Gained few percentiles in the process - obviously a sticky point for a lot of users. Moments of joy were quickly wiped out by the new goal of level 150 😱. I am sure I won't be able to get 35 answers with a mouse and my reflexes.
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Igor Ishchenko
Jul 19, 2024
35? In a minute? jesus